IF NOT STATIN'S, THEN WHAT????

[tchrmgr]

My total cholesterol is over 300! I tried several statin drugs and HATED being on them. Then I discovered this website and went off everything. Tried diet but to no avail. Must be heredity! SO NOW WHAT? WHAT CAN I DO? I'M SO FRIGHTENED I'M GOING TO FALL OVER WITH A HEART ATTACK OR STROKE. Someone respond please. I'm a 55 y/o white female with a daughter and husband who depend on me. Thanks for any and all replies!

[sos_group_owner]

Hi 'tchrmgr' & Welcome to the Forum,

What are your cholesterol levels that total 300?
HDL
LDL
Triglycerides

It's not the 'total' as much as the different levels.

Fran

[tchrmgr]

Thank you. The first test was taken in the office of a diet doctor. The test only reported total cholesterol as being 300 H. I then took another test at a more reputable clinic. That report was as follows:



Cholesterol 225 High

Triglycerides 84

HDL Cholesterol 46

LDL Chol. (calc.) 162 High

Chol/HDL (calc) 4.9 High

LDL/HDL (calc) 3.5



I have been on Lipitor and Prevochol and had horrible reactions to both of these medications and went off of them. I’ve tried becoming a complete vegan, which I loathed, but my levels did not change significantly. What are my options at this point. My doctor simply told me to try to lose some weight (I am 50 lbs overweight) and come back for another test in a few months!)



Thank you for your help.



tchrmgr

[sos_group_owner]

Hi 'tchrmgr',

Triglycerides 84 (great)
HDL Cholesterol 46 (very good - the higher the better)
LDL Chol. (calc.) 162 High

Re: LDL - although your LDL is high than your doctor would like, it's if LDL is 'oxidized' - small particles vs large particles (Pattern A vs Pattern B). Both the VAP and the NMR blood test check for particle size.

I'm not sure if your doctor will order either of these tests, but would be good if your Dr would order homocysteine, hs-CRP ) high sensitivity C-Reactive Protein and Lp (a) - Lipoprotein (a) - all of these check for 'inflammation'.

Do you have any other risk factor? diabetes, high blood pressure?
Has your doctor checked your thyroid? Undiagnosed and un (der) treated hypothyroidism can cause elevated cholesterol.

What to do instead of statins? To control inflammtion: Statin Alternatives

Buffered Aspirin - 81 mg (contains beneficial magnesium)
CoQ10 - 100 to 150 mg (gelcaps - NOT powdered) with some Vit E
* Folic Acid - 400-800 mcg
* B6 - 80-100mg
* B12 - 200-250mcg
* (all 3 of these B Vitamins control Homocysteine)
Omega 3 (Fish Oil or Cod Liver Oil) - There is no upper limit

Dr Graveline's Statin Alternatives reduce and prevent inflammation, are anti-oxidants, reduce platelet stickiness, control (toxic) homocysteine and have the same anti-inflammatory affect as 20 mg's of Lipitor, without side effects.

"Statin Alternatives" are NOT intended to reduce cholesterol levels.
Statins (as do statin alternatives) reduce the type of inflammation that leads to heart attacks and strokes. The fact that statins also reduce cholesterol levels is 'irrelevant'.

Source: http://www.spacedoc.net/statin_alternatives.htm

My personal note: If you are "aspirin sensitive", grape seed extract (GSE) is a good alternative (reduces platelet stickiness/prevents blood clots).

Fran

[vipergg22]

Yours are not that high . You have been sucked into the big pharm idea that if your levels are over 200 you are going to keel over and die tomorrow which is pure garbage . I plugged your numbers into a 10 year heart risk calculator and you have have a whole 2% probability that something might happen in the next 10 years . Your odds of dieing in a car accident are a lot higher than that . You might want to try cinnamon capsules . 2 capsules a day for me lowered the total by over 30 points along with lowering tri's and ldl . Relax you have a very low probability with numbers like that . Think about it , the pharm companies trying to say a number like 200 appropriate for everyone , that is garbage . For some people 230 might be normal . I encourage to read thru the articles here http://spacedoc.net/statin_side_effects.html

[Cat Mom2]

You have bought into their sell pitch. I got off the statins and mine was 253 (after 4 months off statins) the last time it was checked and I think that is GREAT! I did really poorly when it was under 200.

You are not going to drop dead of a heart attack today or tomorrow (Unless it runs in your family and you already have heart disease.) My Mom's was over 360 for about the last 20 years of her life, she did not die of heart disease, and she did not die young.

I think your numbers are wonderful but that is my personal opinion and I am no medical doctor, pharma company or expert. I would be thrilled to have mine at 225 the next time I have mine checked. I am not going to worry until mine it reaches 300. It sounds to me that you are doing it RIGHT already..... except for buying into their bull on the numbers.

[tchrmgr]

Wow! Thanks, everyone. You've all made me feel so much better. I'm going to take all of your advice including 1)more specific testing; 2)cinnamon capsules; 3) baby aspirin et al , and everything else you've said. As it happens, my blood pressure has always been 90/30 and only recently jumped to 110/70 which is still great. I do have heart disease and high cholesterol in my family but I'm not going to worry too much about it now. I do eat steel cut natural oatmeal every morning, don't smoke or drink, and have a pretty healthy diet. My only flaw is the weight (and lack of exercise) and I'm going to work on that.

Thanks again everyone. I really appreciate this forum and Dr. Graveline's wonderful site. Keep up the good work!

tchrmgr

[Biologist]

I'm male and 49 and have been off statins (40 mg. Zocor, the last six months of a six year time frame) for just over three months and now have little concern over what my cholesterol levels are -- the studies (when accurately reported) show that I am not at risk by having "high" cholesterol. My levels are probably normal and healthy, but over 200 for sure. If I were female, I would be even less concerned about my cholesterol levels until it was significantly higher than 300 -- and personally would not take statins even then.

I too take cinnamon capsules as of the last month but only for the purposes of lowering triglycerides. As someone suggested on this forum, I just bought a big bottle of ground cinnamon from Sam's Club for less than $5 (1.12 pounds of it). As far as I know the type and brand (Canela Molida by Tone's, Inc.) is as good as any. When my capsules are gone I will start taking a teaspoon of that everyday, I guess.

BTW, I have recovered a lot, while still not real pleased with energy levels late in the day. But little pain at all any more. A couple of weeks after I quit (after a *major* "energy crisis" and increased tingling in my foot -- neuropathy) was when things got worse for me. (I think that is the time I was critically low on CoQ10 for the first time.) Among other problems, I had to start using extra pillows in my bed and even to sit on -- that has largely cleared up. And a lot or all of shoulder pain and back pain (between the shoulder blades, as has frequently been described on this forum) has been gone for a week of two. Interesting thing is, again, all started AFTER I quit. Now don't get me wrong. It did not start BECAUSE I quit. It would have been much worse if I had continued. It takes several weeks for the CoQ10 levels to get back up even with supplementation when you quit and the drug is still in your system doing damage for a while (including continuing to lower CoQ10) despite your efforts -- at least that is how I visualize events in my own case to describe the progression of problems after quitting. It sounds like you quit before things got out of hand as it did for many or most of us. I think you will do fine.

Do the exercising to a level that is reasonable for you. That pays off in several ways.

Biologist

[Biologist]

I know this post is a little "off topic" for this thread, but it augments parts of my last post right above, so I will include it here anyway. As I mentioned, I believe there is a lag time involved even after serum levels of CoQ10 are elevated back to or above normal levels with supplementation. It may be that it takes the mitochondria a while to absorb the new CoQ10 in the cells, or the cells themselves to absorb the CoQ10; or it may be that additional supporting molecules must be synthesized in the cells to accommodate the new increased supply of CoQ10, which can take a while to manufacture. Who knows?

BTW, where I wrote the following in my post above:

"I think that is the time I was
critically low on CoQ10 for the
first time."

I should have written:

"I think that is the time I was
critically low on CoQ10 for
*an extended period* of time."

One of the excerpts included below from the hyperlink provided may partly explain why I have lost a little weight over the last three months even though I completely quit exercising until real recently.

[http://www.inspiredliving.com/heart-cardio/coQ10-benefits.htm]

"What are the principal uses of CoQ10?

CoQ10 supplementation is used primarily in the treatment of cardiovascular diseases such as elevated cholesterol levels, high blood pressure, congestive heart failure, cardiomyopathy, mitral valve prolapse, coronary artery bypass surgery, and angina. Considerable scientific studies have validated these uses.2-4 CoQ10 has also been shown to be helpful in diabetes; periodontal disease; immune deficiency; cancer; as a weight-loss aid; and muscular dystrophy. Since the response of CoQ10 can take time, a noticeable improvement might not occur until 8 or more weeks after therapy is begun."

"Can CoQ10 lower blood pressure?

Yes. CoQ10 deficiency has been shown to be present in 39% of patients with high blood pressure. This finding alone suggests a need for CoQ10 supplementation. However, CoQ10 appears to provide benefits beyond correction of a deficiency. In several studies CoQ10 has actually been shown to lower blood pressure in patients with hypertension.12-14 The effect of CoQ10 on blood pressure is usually not seen until after 4-12 weeks of therapy. Typical reductions in both systolic and diastolic blood pressure with CoQ10 therapy in patients with high blood pressure are in the 10% range."

Biologist

[tchrmgr]

Thanks, Fran, for your comments. I had a more recent blood test taken with the following results:

Triglycerides: 106, HDL: 50, LDL: 176, and total cholesterol: 247.

You had asked about other risk factors. I do not have diabesters and actually have low blood pressure. Thyroid is ok.

This recent blood test also showed Bun/Creatinine ratio high with 27H (the results also displayed a normal range a being 6-25). What is this and what does it mean?

I do take, as you has mentioned, 81 mg buffered aspirin daily, CoQ10 gelcaps daily, folic acid 800 mcg daily, B12, and Omega 3 Fish Oil. I can't find B6 in an 80-100 mg formulation, though. Any suggestions?

One last thing, what do I ask my doctor regarding specific tests for "inflammation" - you had mentioned homocysteine, hs-CRP?

Thanks for all your help.

[tchrmgr]

Thanks, Biologist, for your fascinating comments. As a newbie to all of this, I am intrigued by the breadth of knowledge demonstrated on this forum, and particularly by yours. Hope things are improving for you. I just sent another post to reply to Fran's comments. Let me know what you think.

I bow to your wisdom in these matters.

[Biologist]

tchrmgr,

Thanks for your comments. You may be referring to the "Question & Answer" section right above. In rereading it just now, I too was very impressed with my apparent new medical knowledge and greatly improved writing skills -- 'til I noticed that it wasn't mine.

It is all pulled from the web URL page listed right above it.

I'm pretty much just a learner at all this too.

Biologist

[Scared by Big Pharm]

Now I am not saying people shouldn't try supplements, diet, exercise etc. for cholesterol...BUT remember in the clinical trials there is less than a 1% difference in the number of people taking statins and the stroke/heart attack risk....so either way the risk doesn't vary much. That is all part of the big lie that makes Drs. put us on this crap in the first place..

Scare tactics due to mis-information.
As my husband likes to say, where there is big money involved, people will die. Don't let you or someone you know be one of them...Just say no to this useless poision.

I say continue to eat right, exercise and take the right supplements and don't stress out over the numbers. Some of us just have naturally high numbers...

STRESS can be more dangerous than the "numbers", so know that you are doing all you can for good heart health and staying off the STATINS is the first, most important step.

Get out there and enjoy life...keep everything in moderation...just like for all other things in life, moderation is a big part of it.

Good luck..

[Biologist]

Well said, Scared by Big Pharm!

Biologist