Statins and CoQ10

[Wallymoe]

I had been taking various statins since the mid 90s with no adverse affects. About three years ago my left buttocks and thigh muscles began to hurt when I stood or walked for any time. I suspected pyriformis syndrome but my doctor insisted that it was spinal stenosis. Soon the aching progressed to the calf muscle and to the other leg. There followed MRIs, epidurals, aqua therapy, Celebrex, etc., wih no improvement. I do have moderate stenosis in the L5 and L6 area. I brought articles to the doctor which talked about statin problems and the beneficiaal effects of CoQ10, but he continued to insist that statins could not be the source of my problem and that stenosis was the culprit. About three weeks ago the discomfort got to the point that it was torture to play even three holes of golf, so I quit the Zetia and 5mg of Lipitor, which was the current medication, and began taking 200 mg of CoQ10 per day. I hope it is not my imagination, but I feel better. Tha aching is significantly less, but I still have weakness, unsteadiness and some aching in both legs..I have read that it takes a long time to recover from the statin damage, so I have a glimmer of hope. I will continue with the CoQ10, Celebrex, a few more sessions of aqua therapy and will hope for the best. Also, my doctor has finally acknowledged that he has been reading some good things about CoQ10s potential beneficial effects, but still prescribes statins.

[adec]

Hi Wallymo. Merck is keenly aware that statins induce CoQ10 depletion, and therefore in turn "can cause an increase in cardiac dysfunction," which "can be life-threatening." In fact, Merck holds the patent for CoQ10 to be coadministered with their statin, Mevacor. And yet, some fifteen years later they continue to negligiently sit on this patent -- I suppose in an attempt to eventually corner the market in a combination CoQ10/statin drug.

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United State Patent: 5,082,650
Title: Amelioration of reductions of coenzyme Q.sub.10 in cardiomyopathy patients receiving lovastatin
Inventors: Folkers; Karl A. (Austin, TX), Langsjoen; Per H. (Temple, TX)
*http://patft1.uspto.gov:80/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=5082650.PN.&OS=PN/5082650&RS=PN/5082650
Abstract: The present invention comprises the serious side effect of mevinolin to depress body levels of coenzyme Q.sub.10 and to correspondingly depress cardiac function and the circumvention of this side effect by the clinical administration of a formulation of coenzyme Q.sub.10 concommitantly with the administration of the mevinolin.
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Again, these are quotes directly from the US patent itself, and fairly inarguable. If your doctor ignores this text, perhaps it's a sign for you to find a new one.

"This invention relates to a newly discovered reduction in levels of coenzyme Q.sub.10 in human subjects which is a side effect from the administration of MEVACOR (lovastatin). The reduction of tissue levels of
coenzyme Q.sub.10 by oral MEVACOR can in turn cause an increase in cardiac dysfunction, and for patients with advanced cardiac disease, this added dysfunction can be life-threatening. Also, a reduction in levels of
CoQ.sub.10 in human subjects by MEVACOR can depress other essential functions in the human body such as the immune function which can also be very clinically serious and even life-threatening, particularly for any
cancer patient."

"The present invention comprises the heretofore overlooked and very serious side effect of MEVACOR to depress body levels of coenzyme Q.sub.10 and to depress correspondingly cardiac function or the pumping of blood by the heart throughout the body, and the circumvention of this death-threatening side effect by the clinical administration of a formulation of coenzyme Q.sub.10 either (1) concomitantly with MEVACOR or (2) by independent formulations of MEVACOR and coenzyme Q.sub.10 by an appropriate dosage schedule for MEVACOR and coenzyme Q.sub.10 (CoQ.sub.10)."
"The depressed cardiac function which can be caused by MEVACOR is associated with the discovered reduction in blood levels of coenzyme Q.sub.10 (CoQ.sub.10) during the clinical administration of MEVACOR."

"CoQ.sub.10 is a redox coenzyme of the respiratory chain including mechanisms of oxidative phosphorylation. These mechanisms have been known as "bioenergetics" and support life functions including the cardiac function or the pumping of blood by the heart. CoQ.sub.10 is a coenzyme for the mitochondrial enzymes: NADH:CoQ.sub.10 reductase, succinate:CoQ.sub.10 reductase, electron transfer flavoprotein:CoQ.sub.10 reductase, reduced CoQ.sub.10 : cytochrome C reductase. The energy coupling roles of CoQ.sub.10, and the apparent antioxidant activity of CoQ.sub.10, are the specific reactions which are important to maintain metabolic functions of organs such as cardiac function. Any pharmacological treatment, any drug treatment such as the clinical administration of MEVACOR to reduce hypercholesterolemia which reduces blood levels of CoQ.sub.10 and thereby reduces the energy-coupling and other roles of CoQ.sub.10 can be clinically detrimental such as to cardiac function and even life itself."

[Ray Holder]

Hi Wallymoe

Muscle pain from statin damage is unlikely to improve using Q10 alone, as permanent damage has most probably been done to carnitine production, and may well show up as elevated CK on a blood test, but not always so.

The Q10 will help to prevent further problems in other systems in the body where statin use has already started its work, but perhaps not yet visible.

L carnitine is necessary to keep up muscle strength, as it is necessary for metablism of fat for energy, and to avoid the muscle protein being used as a substitute to create energy, with consequent wastage, and then to carry waste products away and obviate lactic acidosis and muscle pain.

The correspondence with Darrell in April 2006 under the heading Muscle pain and statins will give you some ideas for starting dosages, and my paper via spacedoc.net/r_holder.html will show the reasonong behind the suggestion.

Ray

[Wallymoe]

Thanks for the info. I am sorry to hear that you believe that it is unlikely that my muscle problems will disappear, but appreciated all of your logic. One thing puzzles me, and that is the fact that my heart is fine - my legs and buttocks muscles are my problem. That might indicate that spinal stenosis is indeed the culprit. Nonetheless, I will continue to take CoQ10 and will not take statins in the future. From what I read, cholesterol levels are less important in the elderly, and I am 84. I'd rather die of a heart attack than live with aching muscles and weak legs.

[Darrell]

Many of us here have leg muscle problems without any obvious heart muscle problems. In fact, some of us here (like me) only have one leg affected. I stopped the damage process before my other leg was fully-involved, and that leg fully recovered fairly quickly.

My still-affected leg is my dominant one. My theory is that the strongest, most-used or most-stressed muscles at the time of statin toxicity are the most-rapidly damaged. A long time ago somewhere on this board we determined that right-leg damage may be more common. Even if that's not your dominant leg, in the U.S. it's the one you use for driving. I never realized how much force I put on the power brake pedal until my leg was damaged.

My heart muscle cell mitochondria may be damaged too, but so far the damage has not reached a threshold to present symptoms. I have not had a cardiac stress test since my statin damage.

[Ray Holder]

Hi Wallymoe
I am just 2 years ahead of you, at 86, and heart weakness problems are one of my concerns, which Q10 is keeping under control, but it is not anywhere near as widespread as is muscle damage from statins.

I would not say that your muscle damage is necessarily permanent, but carnitine deficiency caused by statin damage to Q10 often is, and unless both are supplemented, it prevents normal muscle metabolism occurring, and will damage the muscles more as time goes on.

Try not to take too much energetic exercise while your carnitne is in short supply, it may cause muscle wastage by forcing muscle protein to be used to make energy, instead of fat and carnitine. Some of the statin damage problems are similar in the symptoms shown to normal age related pproblems, and doctors think they are the latter, but they don't respond to conventional treatments.

Your doctor may have heard of carnitine deficiency, it is not well known, but even less well known is the fact that statins can be a cause.

Best of luck with your endeavours

Ray

[Wallymoe]

Ray,
Thanks for all your helpful suggestions. I have a good supply of 100 mg CoQ10s and have ordered some camitine. I am taking 300 mg of the CoQ10 daily and wonder how much camitine I should take when it arrives. By the way, you seem to know quite a bit about the statin problem and I am curious as to how you became so knowledgeable on the subject. You have a great many posts, and seem to know what you are talking about. I will look forward to keeping you advised regarding my status and will continue to value your opinions and suggestions. Wally

[Ray Holder]

Thanks, Wally. I will try to contact you direct via Email

Ray

[Wallymoe]

I quit my Zetia/5mg Lipitor regimen about 2 months ago and started taking CoQ 10. I had been taking various statins for over 10 years, with the Zetia/Lipitor being a recent change. I have had muscle aching in my legs, buttocks and lower back for about three years and finally quit, even though my doctor continued to insist that statins couldn't be the basis for my hurting. This is written to report that I have had no decrease in my aching since quitting the statins, but I hasten to add that I do have a mildly herniated disc as well as some "moderate" stenosis, so I am beginning to conclude that my problem has not been the statins, but rather the spinal problems. I will continue with the CoQ 10 and will not go back on statins or Zetia, but I am afraid that my situation is not improving. Just a status report.

[cjbrooksjc]

Wallymoe: Just a quick note to tell you not to get discouraged. After 10 years on Statins - 2 months is nothing! It will take you one to two years (based on personal experience and what I read daily on this forum) to feel any real sense of recovery. It has been a year and a half since I quit the drug and over a year since I found this forum and began supplement treatment, and I am JUST NOW beginning to think I can recover from this medically imposed affliction. I would say I feel between 65% to 80% recovered. Persevere and keep taking the supplements to help your body heal faster. Keep us updated too; we are all interested in your progress!

Best,

Brooks

[bunnylady]

I finally had a mammogram- was afraid because I had read on this forum about breast cancer post statins- when they said they found a calcification I knew I had cancer even though they said it was just a 10% chance- and I did- its non invasive- I have to decline radiation and tamoxifen because of my bodies challenged problems- then they did an EKG pre sugury and had to do it 5 times- after surgury they told me to see a cardiologist with no other explaination- so I just know that my heart muscle is damaged from the Lipitor-

the cancer could be because I took Prempro- just went off it to go on biodentical hormones too- this is a constant fight to stay ahead of the problems the statins cause

Also have a pulled ligament in my foot for 3 months now and can barely walk- am just a picture of health !

[JL]

this info might be helpful to you. Take care.

*http://www.vitamincfoundation.org/iodine.htm

[adec]

Bunnylady, could you please e-mail me? I have important information to share pertaining to your condition.

[Biologist]

JL,

Very interesting reading from your last hyperlink regarding Iodine & Iodide Compounds. I have been supplementing for several months but am now considering significantly increasing the amounts and maybe the type. I currently take pills made from kelp which do not specify the "ionic configuration" but leave the impression that it is the element iodine itself. The pill dose is 225 mcg each, I may start taking 5 or 10 of them per day.

A question for you regarding Vitamin C supplementation. Do you also supplement with L-Proline and L-Lysine? They are apparently part of "the Linus Pauling program" for assisting C in vascular and collagen health. I have both but have not been as vigilant or regular with taking them until recently. I currently take about four grams of C per day.

Any thoughts on Proline & Lysine? I am guessing they are both so common in the diet, that while they are important, we probably already get plenty?

Hey, Bunnylady, I'm rooting for you.

Thanks.

Biologist

[Biologist]

My post above should have ended like this:

"Any thoughts on Proline & Lysine? I am guessing they are both so common in the diet, that while they are important, we probably already get plenty?

Thanks.

Hey, Bunnylady, I'm rooting for you.

Biologist"

(It is JL I am thanking in advance for his thoughts on Proline & Lysine.)

[JL]

Hi Bunnylady,

take a look at this regimen from Bill Sardi, a medical writer, who knows his stuff when it comes to Vitamin supplements.

*http://www.knowledgeofhealth.com/report.asp?story=Cancer%20Regimen&catagory=Cancer,%20Vitamin%20D

A friend of mine followed this regimen when she had her cancer tumor in her lung. She also called Bill Sardi and he recommended more supplements such as Longevinex, a potent version of Resveratrol which he makes and sells. All of what she took helped shrink the tumor until it disappeared. The first time, she was doing radiation along with supplementation. That was back in 2005.
When a suspicious spot showed up again this year, she took only her supplements and the spots disappeared again.
JL

[JL]

I used to take a lot of l-lysine but have not been taking it and Proline as much anymore. But I do take at least 6 grams of Vit C per day. I am not so sure that I am getting enough L-lysine and l-proline in the diet as maybe you are.